The Great Norfolk/Richmond Throwdown

Trevor Dickerson -- writing for Richmond.com -- has penned a very solid comparison of how two comparable Virginia cities have made different choices over the past 25 years, and where those choices have landed them.

Norfolk and Richmond, as different as they may be, have some remarkable similarities. They both have wonderful riverfront property and similar baseball teams (a trait that Richmond shared until recently, at least).

The biggest difference between the two cities has been what they’ve done with the two.

It's well worth reading, especially if you sit on City Council.

Comments

[stuart squier]

They didn't mention that Norfolk is building Virginia's first new light rail system. The Tide runs along their waterfront for 7.4 miles and is scheduled to open for service in 2010. If you think development is booming there now, look again in five years.

[Marc]

I think that article was a little too harsh on Richmond. Sure, we don't have HarborFest, but we do have the Monument Ave 10k, which draws comparable-sized crowds, not to mention Watermelon Festival, First Fridays, the Browns Island concerts, etc. And I'd rather go shopping in Carytown (or Granby St) than Waterside. I would agree that putting 6th Street Marketplace where it went was a big mistake. And Canal Walk is pretty lame now, although it'll be interesting to see if it finally lives up to its potential when the Reynolds property is redeveloped. Regarding the above comment: Norfolk needs the light rail because their traffic is five times worse than ours. I wish we had light rail too, but there is encouraging noise about building Bus Rapid Transit ("light rail lite") along Broad Street.

[Paul]

"Consultants reportedly advised Richmond city officials to build 6th Street Marketplace on the riverfront, an idea City Council rejected because of the desire to build the development as a bridge between the black and white communities. While a great idea and symbol of unity, it just wasn’t the right place to build the marketplace.

Just imagine if it had been built alongside the Canal Walk or on Brown’s Island. Norfolk has masterfully blended just enough development to bring in tax dollars and foot traffic with ample open space and outdoor entertainment venues.

Just down the street, the Norfolk Tides play ball at Harbor Park, a beautiful waterfront stadium"

Sigh.

I agree with man of Marcs comments, but it is clear we are wasting our waterfront. These same proposals would cause a riot here.

[John]

I don't think they would today, Paul. While there's still a ways to go before we reach any sort of racial or social leavening in this town, Richmond in the early 80s was a very different place in terms of race issues. And while economically Sixth Street Marketplace proved to be a disaster, it was a pretty important statement racially at the time -- not that that really mitigates the economic sound of sucking wind. I think most middle class (and up) Richmonders of all races would cheer some smart waterfront development. I also think that most lower class Richmonders have stopped looking toward City Hall and Main Street for salvation -- and probably wouldn't give a rip if someone built the Taj Mahal on the James.

[Paul]

I think you took this wrong. I wasn't talking about race. I know the lower income working class would welcome the jobs from any ecomonic development, smart or not. It's the upper middle class I'm concerned about.

[Scott Burger]

I think Richmond has more natural riverfront to admire and treasure than Norfolk's. I also don't think Paul H and far too many others really understand and appreciate what development works and does not work in Richmond. Norfolk has taken some big risks, some of which are still playing out. The traffic problems are huge for the whole state. Yes, Norfolk may get some light rail put BACK in place before Richmond, but they really need to do more about the 64/tunnel bottlenecks.

[Paul]

Scott,

• Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
• No risk, no reward
Perhaps I don't understand, but my perception is Richmond is no different from other places in this regard. People want to have a variety of destinations, some natural, some not. We've got the natural nailed down, but it is inaccessable to many people. I know you don't agree, but mixed use developments have worked all around the country, Check out the Project for Public Spaces. It is full of examples that benefit waterfronts, business, tourism, and the community.
http://www.pps.org/

[Scott Burger]

"my perception is Richmond is no different from other places" And that's part of the problem right there.

[Paul]

Scott, please read the entire sentence.

"my perception is Richmond is no different from other places in this regard"

I think Richmond is a unique, interesting and frustating place to live, but it shares a lot challenges other cities do such as how to make the best use of the resources they have.

[Scott Burger]

http://hamptonroads.com/2009/08/city-poised-pull-alcohol-permits-two-waterside-bars The Bar Task Force, composed of police, fire, code enforcement and other city agencies, has been cracking down on alcohol and entertainment violations at Waterside. Fraim said the violations at Bar Norfolk and Have A Nice Day Cafe were simply too frequent. "They certainly have been problematic in their operations," Councilman W. Randy Wright said. "But there are multiple problems at Waterside, including the fact that Waterside's not paying for itself."